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Mark Elbroch [00:00:00] Texas still remains the only state where, you know, there's essentially no regulation for mountain lions.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:07] It's also the only state right now that allows trapping of mountain lions.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:11] Trapping is something generally has been dismissed in other western states for, for a couple of reasons.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:19] One is that it's, it's really difficult to manage trapping and that you get non-target species or non-target classes of animals, even if you're aiming for species.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:32] And because mountain lions occur at such low densities, it's really hard to defend your management plan as a state agency while allowing trapping because you can't say, "Yep, we do not permit kittens being killed", when it's just as easy for a kitten to step into a trap as it is their mother.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:51] And so these kinds of things.

Mark Elbroch [00:00:53] It's also really hard to really check in on the harvest as it's occurring, which they, and generally they enforce in other states. And in Texas, for instance, you don't even have to report.

Mark Elbroch [00:01:04] There are trapping regulations in Texas. If we were to align mountain lions with other trapping regulations, they could at least report, take, you know, within three days of take. And that would be similar to, say, sort of other harvest techniques in other Western states, so you could account for it as it's happening.

Mark Elbroch [00:01:20] But it's, it's also harder to stop. Let's say you have a quota system that, let's say for the Trans-Pecos, there's a limit of 15 lions. What if the 15th lion is killed on October 12th, and so they no longer want any harvest beyond that, but there's traps out all over?

Mark Elbroch [00:01:43] How do you get the message to everybody to pick up their traps? How long does it take for them to pick up their traps?

Mark Elbroch [00:01:49] And so, again, it's just, it's just a much more difficult process to manage than, say, traditional on foot hunting or hound hunting, both of which, like, you could just have an announcement: "Hound hunting is closed". And, you know, many states have these call-in lines. So you call in in the morning, make sure your unit's still open before you go hound-hunting.

Mark Elbroch [00:02:13] So that's, you know, these are the reasons why other states have stopped trapping completely off mountain lions. It's just you can't defend your management plan and say it is science-based and that it's going to be number-based and defensible, while allowing a technique that doesn't control for kitten harvest, versus female harvest, versus male harvest, and, you know, also catches all sorts of other animals in the process.